Intelligent Design, now it's even a newly proposed Uni subject. What comes to your mind when you read the 2 words Intelligent Design? When I first read about it in a magazine, I thought it's an extension to Artificial Intelligence (AI) which I took up as a subject when I was at Uni. Well I was wrong...it wasn't in any way about anything 'Artificial', it was actually quite the opposite of artificial - it was about natural design, so naturally intelligent too. And guess who/what I'm talking about? God. I know that some of you who don't believe in God would be laughing at me, but that's ok, cos you'll have to read on before you say anything about this :). What I'm trying to get across to you here is about that very grand existence you may defy by overlooking the intelligent design that's all around you that only He is capable of. Who is your designer? Can you design another human being just like you, a man, a woman? Who is the designer of nature? Can you design a tree, a river, the ocean, the sun? Can you? True, man can design many things...all based on Artificial Intelligence though, be it a dinner-cooking robot, a supersonic jet, a palm-pilot etc etc. But can he design feelings, emotions,tears,body and the soul? Can he design the Earth, Wind, Ether, Water and Fire? Can you? If you can't, then you're probably not the top-most intelligent designer that there ever was...there is someone else above all of us then. That's Him who is the only intelligent designer that no one else can defeat. And for those who have a theory about us being created just on our own, I wonder how that happened. Give me an 'intelligent' explanation please and I will see if I can make sense out of it.
I may face loads of misfortunes in life..I may not be the luckiest girl on Earth..I may have lost my dad when I was very young..I may not have found true love yet..I may see alot of evil in this world..but none of that will conquer the most natural and the most intelligent design that I see in each of us and the world around us. There has to be a God who holds the copy-rights for the splendid and priceless design embedded in all of us and the nature around us. And we hold the price-tags for the artificiliaty that got built after that. Now who designed this peacock feather so beautifully and gave it the colors that no one else could have? It would have to be a world-class artist who can never be imitated.
Current Music: As Long As You Follow by Fleetwood Mac
181 Cranium Signets:
Hahahhahaha…
Yeah.. even though it may sounds sarcasm to you but I have to agree that the god is definitely intelligent.
1) He created not only man and woman but Gay, Lesbian, bi-sex and Transgender
2)He created devils-satan too (Among his many many creations)
3)He created “smart minds” to human to invent bombs and weapons to kill each other
4)He created RICH and POOR terminologies and way of lives
5)He created “ideologies” to make many people confused such as? WHICH is the correct religion, Christian? Islam? Judaism? Buddist? Hindus? Etc etc etc?
6)He created hunger, pain, suffer and ugly faces to some people while luxuries and good looking to some people
7)He created deaf, dumb, blind, handicap people too
8)He created MANY “intelligences” that always made me thing WHYYYYYYYYYYYY?
Please answer it god, please…. Why cant you be fair?
~~Jay
hahahaha the entire list u have given was created by Man.
Keshi.
it is a very debatable topic
first how ya doing now??????????
then abt post....
gud one....
Humans are clones of the GOD
GOD Created Man
Man created so many things
but they can't re-create aas what the god created
Cheers!
:)
I don't bother much on who created what and why? i simply adore them...:)
Created by man? Oh yea Keshi? Then answer me….
1)Why can’t I have full beard and massive hairs on my chest and my “sexy” legs like Saby?
And…
2)Why cant Saby has fair reddish skin and big/long pinky penis like me?
Saby, you shuddup. Let her answer it for me!
God said, "Let us make man in our image, after our likeness: and let them have dominion over the fish of the sea, and over the birds of the sky, and over the livestock, and over all the earth, and over every creeping thing that creeps on the earth."
God created man in his own image. In God's image he created him; male and female he created them.
God blessed them. God said to them, "Be fruitful, multiply, fill the earth, and subdue it. Have dominion over the fish of the sea, over the birds of the sky, and over every living thing that moves on the earth."
God said, "Behold, I have given you every herb yielding seed, which is on the surface of all the earth, and every tree, which bears fruit yielding seed. It will be your food.
To every animal of the earth, and to every bird of the sky, and to everything that creeps on the earth, in which there is life, I have given every green herb for food;" and it was so.
God saw everything that he had made, and, behold, it was very good.
and ...then...we...did all the mess...
Keshi...sweets...i m glad tat u r back...
huggzzz deary
I'd call Woman as the most intelligent design made by God. And well then comes Alcohol :D
a really interesting post
well absolutely there has to be a supreme power which planned everything just right....anything else and we all wouldnt be here...call that precision :)
call him God call him greatest artist ever
n nice see u back up dear
yeah fanaa was gud..n kajol was ravishing ..really beautiful
stay fit
Keshi..
Read God's Debri by
Scott Adams the Dilbert Guy...
Even Charles Darwin questioned his own theory of evolution as 'how something as complex as human retina can evolve from something as primitive as amoeba'.
Creation implies creator.
Keshiiiiiiiii...
Hi Keshi. Now that you're back...You've been tagged. Would you be so kind enough to check the details on my blog and do the needful please?
Thank you.
God is placebo effect..
And that was french lady. It meant, "Hello Madam, welcome back".
If you are back that means your blood type is AB+ve i.e. Always Be +ve.
Mine is same
It's just a big miracle and wonder!
But you probably shouldn't think about so heavy topics when you still sick sick ;-D
give your brain a rest babe!
Oh well!!
thats an interesting way of putting it!!
See you gotta win men by logic...and now that uv given it an almost scientific sounding name...I might just become more of a god believer!;-)
baeutiful post...
god's most intelligent design...human being...though the designs has many flaws but by far its the best one...
awesome post, keshi!
that is a wonderful way of thinking about our creator. An artist, a designer.
HE is remarkable, isn`t HE? how can people deny his existance when they love among all of HIS miracles?
this is bound to be a controversial topic dear ... but i'm sure u don't mind ...
i too believe that we r created beings ... not only that, i believe that every single thing is destined ... but that wld be an even more controversial topic .. lolz ... :)
All is one!
I don't really 'wonder' about how God works his business of running our lives...nor question it. I'm just glad He is running it and not some evil being whose interest is simply to steal our souls in the worst possible way(s).
ok...by no way I can agree with this...sorry...im a scientist you see. And yes, we can make another person...by cloning, which while it is not perfect now...in the coming years when technology improves, we will have clones nearning perfection. You also talked about emotion, feelings; cloned rats and animals do show feelings, emotions (which can be detected through their chemical cycles), and do interact.
There is a differential view in general of ID...its a disguise of the same damn crap named Creationism. We have time and time again disapproved creationism, id because the only true thing is Evolution. We all evolved,like it or not...and we have fossil proof's for it.
About the universe, it did not come out of nowhere, there are concepts of before the big bang, singularity and such that permits non existance of God.
I personally believe a creator, in a general sense, who might have created everything, but I dont believe every particular senses to be crafted. Evolution can create beautiful things, the tribolites to the dinosaurs to humans. We are works of millions of years of creation.
HUmans created culture, which in its true sense is ID, we are intelligent, hence we designed culture and RELIGION and GOD. In any way you look at, everything arose naturally, no form of invisible hand did anything.
For personal beliefs, I do pray everyday...because I want to believe in a creator for giving a place to look up to...a sense of belonging. It ends there. But i respect believers, because you have less chance to go wrong...I just want to go wrong because I can learn more.
P/s: Ur flue fine now?>
Hey Keshi Girl! How are you feeling now? Please do take care of yourself. And about your post - I just loved it - beautiful, profound. I relate so much to your posts as if I am talking to myself. Me too down with fever but in office, few more days so have to be :(:(
Hey, how u doing?
First take care n be well.
God can wait :D
Sophia and Keshi
SHIT !
dont start dis debate again
Galileo found it hard to convince Sophia (and other guys who read the Bible literally) dat the earth moves round the sun
He was incarcerated by the Pope
Now Darwin is being targetted again
there is hard core evidence dat evolution happened
U just have to look at JAY to see dat his forefathers were apes
Now Keshi
JAY wants an answer to his question
dont let me down
Ohh goodness.
The truth is the truth irrespective of what each of us think. To me truth is there is a God, to some there is no God. Ok. To each his own. Live and let live.
It is the very belief in God that keeps us alive. Keeps me alive.
In God I trust
Signed sealed and delivered.
~~Burf
yes I know...but can u contribute plz? Or is this post stupid too Burfy? ;-)
~~The_protector
hey Vishnu thanks alot, I'm doing pretty good! U see I cant stay away from all of u for too long...I crave for 'intelligent' discussion :):)
**GOD Created Man
Man created so many things
U got it mate, spot on!
Keshi.
~~Jay
hey Jay :)
**Created by man? Oh yea Keshi? Then answer me….
Sure mate!
**1)Why can’t I have full beard and massive hairs on my chest and my “sexy” legs like Saby?
well didnt u in ur first comment say something like this too...
**He created deaf, dumb, blind, handicap people too
well so the ans to ur Q
"Why can’t I have full beard and massive hairs on my chest"
God may have created deafness/blindness so that by seeing ppl who r blind/deaf etc, others like u and I wont be so obsessed over something so minor as chest hair or leg hair. Maybe we have alesson there.
Imagine if every one on this Earth was created with all 5senses and great body and hair and wut nots...wud u appreciate the world...wud u know the good and the bad...wud u know what it is to be fortunate...??
**2)Why cant Saby has fair reddish skin and big/long pinky penis like me?
do u judge ppl by their skin color Jay? If u think fair/reddish skin color and a big d##k is what LIFE is, then u have a long way to go mate :)
**Saby, you shuddup. Let her answer it for me!
I guess I answered U jay. No hard feelings...just a healthy 'intelligent' debate ok?? :) Thanks and I appreciate ur questions and interaction this way!
Keshi.
~~Sophie
hey that was a very graphic and beautiful explanation of Creation...thanks girl!
**In God's image he created him; male and female he created them.
yes I believe that...or else, who came up with this male/female sectors? And why so in every animal?
And hell yeah, we created the mess :)
Keshi.
~~Me
**I'd call Woman as the most intelligent design made by God
Im so glad that a guy could honestly say that :)
Alcohol? lol no ways...we created that,hahahaha!
Keshi.
~~Desperado
hey thanks matey :)
**....anything else and we all wouldnt be here...call that precision
so true! Thats so very true...
I gotta see Fanaa then...awww...
Keshi.
~~Kannan Udayarajan
Thanks for that Kannan..I will try to get it then :)
~~Invincible
hey v000nie Im well thanks so much!
** 'how something as complex as human retina can evolve from something as primitive as amoeba'.
aha....the retina, the vocals, the heart, the lungs etc etc...they all carry very intelligent designs of a creative artist...an imagination and a level of intelligence that can never be matched!
Thanks for that v000nie!
Keshi.
~~Southpaw
thats a good thing Southy...some ppl dun even adore the creations but find faults...so ur doing well mate!
Keshi.
~~Nishu
hey Nishu!
**creator does not always imply acreator
didnr get that...plz elaborate...
**but there is a creator than he did a fabulous job i bet
yes...splendid job!
Keshi.
~~Me
hey Me again!
I gave u the tag link na? hope u got it :)
**To me truth is there is a God, to some there is no God. Ok. To each his own. Live and let live.
true...I agree with ya.
This post is not to make anyone feel bad but just to debate upon the Intelligent Design aspect...so I hope ppl who dun believe in God dun get offended but happily take part here :)
**It is the very belief in God that keeps us alive. Keeps me alive.
So true..thanks!
**In God I trust
Signed sealed and delivered.
aww ur so sweet...hehe thanks mate, and In God I Trust too...cos what am I if not.
Keshi.
~~Kumar_Chetan
hehe Placebo Effect...so u mean its just a belief? I agree mebbe some ppl may feel that way cos no one has seen God in front of their eyes...but my Q in this post is then who is the Designer of us?
**AB+ve i.e. Always Be +ve.
hehe so cute lol! Thanks I just got to know my blood type then :):)
Feeling better thanks to all of u..hugggggz!
Keshi.
~~Die_Murane
**But you probably shouldn't think about so heavy topics when you still sick sick
lol yeah..but a topic abt God is the most relaxing one for my brain :)
Keshi.
~~Vanathi
hey where have u been? Huggggggggz girl!
Keshi.
~~Anand
:) u raised a good point...
**and now that uv given it an almost scientific sounding name...I might just become more of a god believer
Scientists and Theologists dont always agree...why? can u ans that :)
Keshi.
~~Alice
hey Alice!
**though the designs has many flaws but by far its the best one...
Alice thats so true...the design may have flaws for a reason too...imagine if we were all flawless and 100% healthy..wut kind of shallow world wud that be! There is so much love (amisdt the hatred), there is so much happiness(amidst sadness) cos we know we r not perfect and that some day we have to die...
Keshi.
~~Still_Figuring_Out
hey SFO sweety!
**how can people deny his existance when they love among all of HIS miracles?
Spot on! Exactly the gist of this post! How can ppl deny a creator's existence when we ourselves r moracles? ppl wait for artifical magic to happen to believe in a God..but in that process they fail to notice the miracles that we r and thats all ard us already...
Keshi.
~~Anup.777
hey Anup hugggggggz!
**i too believe that we r created beings ... not only that, i believe that every single thing is destined
Well i believe in all that too...controversial it may be, but its ok as long as we can provide our facts..:)
Thanks dude!
Keshi.
~~Pradeep.K
All is one...true...so true...we r diffrent in looks but we all have the same emotions...one birth and one death....
Keshi.
~~Nikita
hey Niki!
** I'm just glad He is running it and not some evil being whose interest is simply to steal our souls in the worst possible way(s).
true...and thanks!
Keshi.
~~Ghost_Particle
hey Ghosty Im ok now, thanks a ton! Im coughing like a puppy still but Im not feeling feverish anymore and the chest congestion is cleared...thanks :)
**ok...by no way I can agree with this...sorry...im a scientist you see.
hehe its ok mate, we r not here to agree on everything...as long as we discuss in good terms.
but did u ever think God in terms of a scientist too - perhaps of a science that we may not have mastered yet?
**And yes, we can make another person...
thats cloning someone thats alreasy there hai na?
**cloned rats and animals do show feelings, emotions (which can be detected through their chemical cycles), and do interact.
but isnt this like we r copying what God already created? Can we be unique as He has been with his creations?
**We have time and time again disapproved creationism, id because the only true thing is Evolution. We all evolved,like it or not...and we have fossil proof's for it.
how? ok even then what/who created the toungue with so many taste buds? Who created the digestive system and its mechanism? It couldnt have just happened on its own? If so why dun such things take place now?
**I personally believe a creator, in a general sense, who might have created everything, but I dont believe every particular senses to be crafted. Evolution can create beautiful things, the tribolites to the dinosaurs to humans. We are works of millions of years of creation.
yes we may be...but who/what created the design in us?
**HUmans created culture, which in its true sense is ID, we are intelligent, hence we designed culture and RELIGION and GOD.
culture/religion is artificial..not natural. God may not be seen ard, but there r alot of things that prove his existence...like what I mentioned in my post.
**In any way you look at, everything arose naturally, no form of invisible hand did anything.
naturally? What's that natural force/power or whatever it was? :)
**For personal beliefs, I do pray everyday...because I want to believe in a creator for giving a place to look up to...a sense of belonging. It ends there.
mmmm if u dun believe in a God ghosty, how can u pray? Just asking..
**But i respect believers, because you have less chance to go wrong...I just want to go wrong because I can learn more.
hehe ok...well if u think believers of God hv less chance og going wrong, then thats wrong..U have already proved ur theory Ghosty :):)
Thanks so much for u r 'intelligent' contribution...was great to discuss this with ya!
Keshi.
~~Astral
hey thanks Suchi...awww u tc care too now...huggggggggggggggggz!
Sends angel blessings to ya!
Keshi.
~~Saby
hehe Saby ur so funny lol!
So whats ur take on this? Out with it Saby :)
Keshi.
I am sorry but I have to differ with you on this.
Intelligent design is a hokey disguised as a "theory" perpetuated by religious fundamentalists in the US, who desperately want to tear down the wall between Church and State. Their intent is to say the universe is so complex that it cannot have evolved, there has to have been an intelligent designer behind it all. That is god.
There is simply no proof being offered by them to support this.
Simply pointing to it and saying this has to be a design of god is not proof.
Evolution took Aeons to happen literally millions of years. One can see that thru fossil and other records. Evolution may not be the complete explanation but it is definetly not hokey like intelligent design is.
That being said people are free to believe there is a hgher being that controls it all. It is not something that has to be taught in science class. That is undermining science. Sorry if this sounds impassioned or offtopic, but it is cos Intelligent Design is the catch phrase being used by religious zealots to undermine science and try and teach religion in science class where it has no place.
Also saying humans cannot design another human is fair but not a legit comparison. Humans evolved over thousands of years, once cannot just replicate that but whio knows it might happen in the future.
Also buddy this is not personal and nor am I trying to disrespect what you believe. I am merely pointing out that I.D the term is probably not what you want to use. Also it's not that hard to say you believe in science/evolution and are also religious, the two are fairly compatible.
Glad you are feeling better. :)
aww ty so much for the kind wishes on my bday. I feel so loved *hugs* Im getting along, just extremely bagged, may post a lil later today.
Good to have u back Keshi. Hope u r feeling better.....and ur wings r in place :)
Now, whether we like it or not, there is a unexplainable force beyond us, beyond our control. For me this force is nature, "God" in the form I can understand.
It was a good point u made in reply to Jay - religion, ideology, caste, social segregation are all man made. All are equal at birth, ah yes, some of us have defects - it only shows that nature is not always perfect.
Imagine a world without pain, without disease, without disabilities.......would we have advanced so much? There would have been no need to come out of the cavemen lifestyle of our ancestors. And talk abt war, discrimination, atrocities, etc all these are man made so only we can stop it.
hey kesh darll...
gosh am soo late here ...
i cant deny to whateva u said sweety .. n ya i appreciapte his creation ... n some master pieces like u n raj ;)
muahhhhh n huggzzzzzzz
KESHI: “Intelligent design” = “the teleological argument” with a new name. It’s one of a number of supposed proofs for the existence of God advanced in the Middle Ages. All were fatally flawed.
In the case of the teleological argument (“argument from design”), what you’ve got is an analogy which states that the universe is like a man-made object.
Say you find a watch in the desert. You know that it must have been made by a person.
But the universe could be like a tomato. If you see a tomato on the lawn, you don’t search for a “tomato-maker.” There is no reason why being or existence itself might not have the attribute of creativity rather than requiring a Maker. There is no reason that nature couldn’t be organic, so to speak.
When you think about it, if the existence of God could be proved or even a compelling case for it made, then anyone capable of following the arguments would believe in God. All the smart people would be believers.
That said, I share all the feelings and attitudes your post discusses. But I experience them as I experience faith: in relation to reality or Being itself, and not a Creator of creation in whose existence I couldn’t believe even if I still wanted to.
hey dis got me run riot laughing..........man dis is too good 4 a psot should be lauded..........love de sarcasm though..........very caustic.........keep up de good work girl
Cheers,
Abhi
God is the ultimate designer. He not only designs us but also designs our destiny.
~~Keshi
Yep, got the tag link. Vielen dank!
And well.. yeh i'm sweet. 4 cubes of a sugar a day ;)
luks like Im'ma late this time :(
herz my take ... I am not a non believer in god ... but still in pursuit to understand him ... but I have a faint belief that god is in the collective spirit of the lifeforms we know of ... that equates to nature
humans fundamentally need to believe ... coz when we can't the very existence/purpose is under question ... plenty to substantiate & explain so I leave it 4 u to think 4 now :)
science explains a lot ... n that which science cannot is attributed to god (whoz like a scapegoat)
if u'd be a lil observent u'd see that when everything in the world fails, u put ur belief in god ... coz that (belief in ur existence) is the very essence of ur living :) ... even if god fails some still believe in hope that he is being testy ;) ... giving themselves a faint reason to live on
to me nature is god ... just like those unknown rays got to be known as X-Rays (if u remember the origin of the name) ... influence beyond human comprehension is deemed as god :)
I do wonder if paganism is the source of all religion :-?
Nice thoughts....but somehow the IITian inside me says its not a miracle but just a beauty of science making all of these :)
Hi babe. Giving me even more reasons to love you. It takes balls to talk about God, and more so to admit to believing in Him. Cynics and cowards choose not to believe in Him, though I don't think it's possible to lie to oneself. That means that their heart knows the truth, but they choose not to see it, because it's inconvenient to believe in God. It demands effort, it demands a motion of the will, it demands faith - the blind sort - and it's easier for people to believe in their own half-assed explanations of how The Universe works than it is to believe in "Intelligent Design". What's more, it's far easier to stick their head up their fellow man's rear end than to dare have an honest opinion all of their own. God? Jesus? What WILL the neighbors think!?
Personally I prefer not casting the net out there like that and seeking feedback on God, because every numbskull in Creation, it seems, chimes in with whatever idiotic notion they picked up in the tabloids or reading some poor fool's opinion in the New York Times. I smile at it all and tell myself that God loves the common man: he made so many...
You're a gem indeed and I admire your bravery at bringing up the subject (gasp! God!)
Hey...I too thought of some robot or something to equal tht when I first read the word...I do belive ion God, and for those who come to me and tell me there is no such thing- I tell them tht maybe his name is not God, we dont know- but there is someone who does something to each of us and tht is osme one very powerful and is like he has the remote....Good and bad, hapinezz and sadness are wht we feel and something tht occurs in this chain of life....I dont really justify the "why does God make such things happen tht destroys so many humans"....
Just tht I am very much aware of a strong presence n my belief is hard....Insightful post Keshi!
1. In the beginning God created the heavens and the earth.
2. Now the earth was [a] formless and empty, darkness was over the surface of the deep, and the Spirit of God was hovering over the waters.
1. In the beginning was the Word, and the Word was with God, and the Word was God.
2. He was with God in the beginning.
3. Through him all things were made; without him nothing was made that has been made.
4. In him was life, and that life was the light of men.
5. The light shines in the darkness, but the darkness has not understood[a] it.
..........................
May those still groping in the darkness see the light of His Truth.
heyy mate !
glad you are well again even a little and spreading your wings.
huggggzzz!
we don't mind the germs :-)
-
problem with intelligent design as a subject is that people try make it in to a science subject (like evolutionary theory) even though it fails as a scientific theory in that its basic premise that universe was created by an external intelligence cannot be proved or disproved. it is ok as philosophy or theology, but actually redundant there, since such things are already included under those.
there is nothing incompatible between evolution and god. it is just that we should not confuse so very different things together.
when it comes to god, people has to make a decision about the world. there are lot of things in the world that cannot be easily explained. world may not be rational, in fact it may just be meaningless chaos. but we humans feel an internal desire to explain things rationally. most of us cannot face the reality otherwise.
for instance most of us cannot accept that there is no difference between good or bad, that there is absolutely nothing after death etc.( even that design of a peacock feather is a result of random evolution) as rationality tell us. we need those things to be explained as part of a system or design. so we feel a need to believe in some supernatural phenomenon that will make sense of all those things. hence the belief in god (whether there is a god or not cannot be proved so what i am talking is belief in god).
it is all in how we explain the world to ourselves. (in science we limit ourselves to clearly defined scientific methods, in religion we do not)
intolerance arise when ppl try to impose their explanation of the world(read religion etc.) on others with different explanations.
some ppl of course may feel they do not need the explanations they may accept the world as it is; meaningless chaos.
-
have a good day and do take care of yourself. :-)
~~Karmic_Jay
hey Jay hows ya? :)
Ofcourse we dun have to agree on everything...lets just discuss and I'm happy u were honest abt ur feelings even tho they dun agree with mine...thanks! And hey dun be sorry :)
**Intelligent design is a hokey disguised as a "theory" perpetuated by religious fundamentalists in the US, who desperately want to tear down the wall between Church and State.
Ok but why wud anyone want to tear down the wall between the Church and the State? I'm sure even many ppl who belong to the State authorities still believe in a God ...dun they? Well even if they dun, it's not a question of getting them to 'believe' in ID, but perhaps to start thinking what/who might be the reason behind ID...just to get us thinking w.o. just going on abt our lives as if nothing was desinged by anyone or anything else. perhaps?
**There is simply no proof being offered by them to support this.
Simply pointing to it and saying this has to be a design of god is not proof.
But does having no proof always mean there's no truth?
**Evolution took Aeons to happen literally millions of years. One can see that thru fossil and other records.
Agreed...but even b4 those millions of years, who/what made LIFE begin?
**Evolution may not be the complete explanation but it is definetly not hokey like intelligent design is.
Evoloution too doesnt have 100% proof but u still choose to believe in that and not ID? :)
**It is not something that has to be taught in science class. That is undermining science.
:) Why wud that be undermining Science? Science is a field that man made to understand what's going on ard us...Science involves experiments, results and conclusions. It's very limited compared to ID...cos we dunno how to experiment with ID so we choose to ignore it and consider it as undermining Science?
**it is cos Intelligent Design is the catch phrase being used by religious zealots to undermine science and try and teach religion in science class where it has no place.
indeed...perhaps it has no place in Science class...cos ID is perhaps not a science that we can understand so we r threatened by it..perhaps? :)
**Humans evolved over thousands of years, once cannot just replicate that but whio knows it might happen in the future.
One cannot replicate that cos we dun have the power to do so :)
**I am merely pointing out that I.D the term is probably not what you want to use.
hehe but I think ID is a very appropriate term Jay :)
**Also it's not that hard to say you believe in science/evolution and are also religious, the two are fairly compatible.
Maybe I believe in all of evolution/science/God cos it's prolly one maker's creations...:)
yeah we can just agree to disagree Jay...I was just pointing out what I believe and Im glad u pointed out what u believe...it's a very interesting debate isnt it :) Thanks for ur contribution!
**Glad you are feeling better. :)
hey thanks Jay...I feel alot better today, thanks to all of ur wishes!
have a good day!
Keshi.
~~Miranda
heyyyyy Miranda now u better tc lady! I was praying for ya...HUGGGGGGGGGGGGGGZ!
Keshi.
~~Madhu
hey thanks :)
**Imagine a world without pain, without disease, without disabilities.......would we have advanced so much?
Spot on! Why wud there be a world at all if all of us looked drop-dead gorgeous, had top fitness levels, no disease, no sadness, no poverty, no differences? If a God made us like that then He would have to be dumb lol!
Keshi.
~~Uttara
Uttsy u feeling betta now? TC sweety or God will come down witha stick and in Keshi form lol!
** some master pieces like u n raj
hahaha very funny Uttsy..must be Raj and U but not me :)
Hugggggggggz bubbz!
Keshi.
~~Darius
hey mate!
**It’s one of a number of supposed proofs for the existence of God advanced in the Middle Ages. All were fatally flawed.
flaws make it perfect :)
**Say you find a watch in the desert. You know that it must have been made by a person.
yes agreed.
**But the universe could be like a tomato. If you see a tomato on the lawn, you don’t search for a “tomato-maker.”
true I wont be searching for a tomato-maker cos I know it came from a plant...and I know that that plant came from a....?
**There is no reason why being or existence itself might not have the attribute of creativity rather than requiring a Maker.
ok..I can see what ur saying. But wud the watch u were talking abt have no maker? Could it have been just created on it's own? Never.
**and not a Creator of creation in whose existence I couldn’t believe even if I still wanted to.
why wont u? just asking...
Thanks matey :)
Keshi.
~~Abhialldeway
hey Abhi!
**hey dis got me run riot laughing..........man dis is too good 4 a psot should be lauded
HUH this post is not funny?? did u post the wrong comment here...one that should go to another post? :)
Keshi.
~~Suji
hey Suji!
**God is the ultimate designer. He not only designs us but also designs our destiny.
thats what I believe in too...but thats not just cos I want to believe that...just taking a look at the human form and the body's mechanisms, nature and it's ways, makes me believe in a Creator...
thanks girl :)
~~Me
**Yep, got the tag link. Vielen dank!
huh? :)
**And well.. yeh i'm sweet. 4 cubes of a sugar a day ;)
awww then u might give me diabetes..:):)
Keshi.
Here is my belief, there is a God. I am sure of it. I know it.
But He did not sit there and create things in this universe like a toymaker creates toys.
He set in motion Mother Nature...and it's been spinning ever since.
Man is descended from apes...and humans are STILL evolving. With the completion of the mapping of the human gene just last month, the door of knowledge has opened up even wider.
Humans are still evolving, and there are lots of genetic differences between the different "races" of humans to show how we are still evolving.
~~Samy
hey Samy better late than neva :)
**but I have a faint belief that god is in the collective spirit of the lifeforms we know of ... that equates to nature
true...a good analysis Samy!
**humans fundamentally need to believe ... coz when we can't the very existence/purpose is under question ...
true...but who even made us that way? :)
**science explains a lot ... n that which science cannot is attributed to god (whoz like a scapegoat)
not really..Science still cant explain alot of things such as why some ppl carry certain genes etc...but doctors categorise that as 'unexplained genetics' or 'unresearched' and still go on with life. And most of the time we refuse to think outside 'science'...and why is that? perhaps we r threatened by Intelligent Design which we may neva u'stand? Perhaps thats one area we can neva conquer so we decide to shut ourselves from it calling it religious garbage that undermines Science?
**if u'd be a lil observent u'd see that when everything in the world fails, u put ur belief in god ...
hahahahaha wrong! When everything has failed ard me, I hated God...I disliked Him..I cursed Him...but I realised it's not Him...it's my own deeds and the ppl ard me that has caused my world to fail. And if I see racism, evil acts in other parts of the world, it's ppl who create such things...not Him. The belief in Him always exists, whether in good/bad times...
**coz that (belief in ur existence) is the very essence of ur living :) ... even if god fails some still believe in hope that he is being testy ;) ...
nope I dun believe He 'tests' us like we perform tests in Science labs :) I guess we have a pre-destined map to travel...for some reason that may well be a part of the Intelligent Design...
**to me nature is god ... just like those unknown rays got to be known as X-Rays (if u remember the origin of the name) ...
yes...u dun see those rays but u believe in those rays dun u?
**influence beyond human comprehension is deemed as god :)
good description...
**I do wonder if paganism is the source of all religion :-?
I have no idea...but religion I believe is man-made and has now become a curse to many...
Thanks Samy!
Keshi.
~~Coolvir
hey Vir hows u? :)
**but somehow the IITian inside me says its not a miracle but just a beauty of science making all of these
ok u mebbe right..but what is Science? :)
Keshi.
~~Rockenpooper
Hey dude hows ya? :)
**That means that their heart knows the truth, but they choose not to see it, because it's inconvenient to believe in God.
well I dunno if every person here who doesnt believe in a God does that in denial..each one of them may have thei rvery valid reasons. But I do know that it's kind of inconvenient for many to 'believe' in Intelligent Design just cos it doesnt fall in place with a Science we have mastered. So it becomes too much to even try n u'stand and hence seems like 'bullsh#t'...:)
yep, God loves the 'common' man and arent we all oh so common :):)
Thanks matey!
Keshi.
~~Scribblez_To_Wakeup
hey Girl!
**- I tell them tht maybe his name is not God, we dont know
yes..mebbe 'God' is not the right word...but the common word is 'Creator' perhaps...
A 'Belief' is usually based on our experiences...to me the 'belief' in a God is simply based on what I see in us...what I see in nature...trees, oceans and man could not have just come out of dust...
Thanks Scribblez :)
Keshi.
~~Orikinla_Osinachi
hey hows u?
**5. The light shines in the darkness, but the darkness has not understood[a] it.
I just love that line....so true! Darkness is absence of Light..the light is understood but not the darkness...beautiful words! That itself is enough for us to believe in Him!
Keshi.
~~Sittingnut
hey thanks and o yeah Im betta :) So I send alot of germs to ya..hahahahahaha just kidding ;-)
I wanted u to comment on this post cos this is the one I was telling u abt...thanks for commenting!
**problem with intelligent design as a subject is that people try make it in to a science subject (like evolutionary theory) even though it fails as a scientific theory in that its basic premise that universe was created by an external intelligence cannot be proved or disproved.
if it cannot be 'disproved' as well, then why is ID considered a problem? Is it just cos we dun u'stand it or just cos it's not a Science we have mastered yet?
**it is ok as philosophy or theology, but actually redundant there, since such things are already included under those.
what cannot be understood by the human brain wont always end up being redundant does it?
**there is nothing incompatible between evolution and god. it is just that we should not confuse so very different things together.
so r u saying there may have been a God that may have designed evolution?
**there are lot of things in the world that cannot be easily explained. world may not be rational, in fact it may just be meaningless chaos.
may seem meaningless only cos we cant understand certain things :)
**but we humans feel an internal desire to explain things rationally. most of us cannot face the reality otherwise.
yes and thats why we created Science :) Experiments, observations and Results with a conclusion...that's what Science is - we need everything in set results or else we think it's meaningless :)
**for instance most of us cannot accept that there is no difference between good or bad, that there is absolutely nothing after death etc.( even that design of a peacock feather is a result of random evolution) as rationality tell us.
how do we know that there's nothign after death? No dead man lived to tell that isnt it :) And how do we know that this peacock feather is a result of evolution? Even if it was, then who designed evolution?
**we need those things to be explained as part of a system or design. so we feel a need to believe in some supernatural phenomenon that will make sense of all those things.
so r u saying Desing has not designer? Take an example...a PC is designed...a Data Flow diagram is designed...a dress is designed. We all know that whatever on this Earth have been designed by Man. So who designed Man then?
**hence the belief in god (whether there is a god or not cannot be proved so what i am talking is belief in god).
ok just cos it cannot be proved, does it make it untrue? I mean take a look at this...we dun SEE the vapor in the air...but we do know it exists and that's Science too :)
**it is all in how we explain the world to ourselves. (in science we limit ourselves to clearly defined scientific methods, in religion we do not)
yes true...so anything that's not within Science's limits get disregarded as somethign non-existent?
**intolerance arise when ppl try to impose their explanation of the world(read religion etc.) on others with different explanations.
true...but we dun have to fight lol! :) We can just duscuss like we r doing here na. ppl who dun tolerate others' harmless beliefs r pathetic.
**some ppl of course may feel they do not need the explanations they may accept the world as it is; meaningless chaos.
awww so u think this world is meaningless chaos? why? :)
hey u have a good day too matey...and thanks so much for this!
Keshi.
~~The_Phoenix
hey hows ya?
**Here is my belief, there is a God. I am sure of it. I know it.
But He did not sit there and create things in this universe like a toymaker creates toys.
ok :)
**He set in motion Mother Nature...and it's been spinning ever since.
wow thats a nice description of it...
**Man is descended from apes...and humans are STILL evolving.
ok where did the apes come from?
**Humans are still evolving, and there are lots of genetic differences between the different "races" of humans to show how we are still evolving.
true..this will ans Jay's question abt differences in physical attributes :)
Thanks alot Phoenix!
Keshi.
, , dis is for Sophia and orikinla and other christians and Keshi and Karen, ,
i saw DA VINCI CODE the movie today
i see sumting sinister in the catlik church
the papacy in vatican have some dark secrets that are being well concealed
the crusades
the inquisition
the bible consists of some 50 books and more
some of these books are not published, the vatican has them
Pithaly has more info on this subject
the elections of the Pope are always secret, in closed doors
aside from the formulation for COKE there are no other secrets im todays world
classified info in america is declassified after 20 years and made accessible to the public
i am suspicious of secret societies like the Masonic Lodge and the Vatican
the catlik church has failed to make the OLD TESTAMENT obsolete
Jesus did
eye for an eye is not Jesus
i wish Jay wud evolve into a sexy man like Saby who loves women and not cats
would agree with you word to word.
just saw your comment in my blog.. u online ?
:D
***hahaha very funny Uttsy..must be Raj and U but not me :)
am not joking sweety ....
hows ya?????
have a nice day babes
am doing ok!!!
** true...but who even made us that way? :)
nature & evolution ... no one deliberately made us that way ... two possibilities ... those who believe in purpose to their existence and those who didn't ... the later dimished in number since they had no reason to ... natutral selection :)
** perhaps we r threatened by Intelligent Design which we may neva u'stand?
thatz a contradiction, humans only accept that which we can comprehended. even if what u said was true we'd proly be happy to know about it
** Perhaps thats one area we can neva conquer so we decide to shut ourselves from it calling it religious garbage that undermines Science?
u call it garbage ... I say religion is the science of psychology and mind control :)
** hahahahaha wrong! When everything has failed ard me, I hated God
exactly my point ... when u believe in yourself (as in taking responsibility for what has happened) u dun need god ... when u dun u go to god in seek of purpose arising from hope :)
** I guess we have a pre-destined map to travel
again something we choose to believe in
-----
in my opinion god is a concept invented by men (the wise of the early period) to keep things under control and people from breaking down ... no individual can thrust morality into people by didacting to them ... but when said god said so ppl believe in it ... again this concept emanated by natural selection ... those people who believed in god survived the toll of time while others diminished :) ... as their will to live was less ;)
I do have a post commin up which is kinda related to this ... quite serious to thought so giving it some time :)
and yes ... I do believe in god ... as in someone who I could resort to when everyone else fails me :) ... my way of surviving the winter :D
~~Saby
Having said all that, wuts ur point?? Be clear when u say something...so what d u think about Intelligent Design? :)
~~Archana
hey girl yep Im online :)
~~Uttara
lol nana nanananana it's u and raj..certainly not me :)
Hugggggggggz! Good to know ur feeling betta...
Pretty woman..dekho dekho na...pretty woman...lalala...
Keshi.
~~Samy
**and yes ... I do believe in god ... as in someone who I could resort to when everyone else fails me :) ... my way of surviving the winter
no u got me wrong..lol..I didnt say that I only believe in a God only when everything else has failed...no ways. Thats why I said in the post that good/bad whatever happens to me, doesnt conquer the Intelligent Design thats embedded in us...
and u say nature & evolution created us this way..then who created nature and evolution?
Anyways lets just agree to disagree Samy...better that way that argue endlessely :)
I look forward to ur post...
Keshi.
the Bible is not a book to explain the origin of the universe
for dat we have science
Religion and thelogy is about God and wat He wants from us
all Me wants us to do is to love one another wid all u gott
nothing else matters
the name u give to your God be it Jesus, Allah or Ram dont count
its not easy to Love in dis fashion
it means if u have 2 shirts give one to the other who has none
dis stoopid debate on theory of creation is for armchair cristians
an exercise in futility
Beautiful post. And yes, I believe that God is my designer and the designer of nature.
That's why I love nature so much...it brings me in touch with the marvels of God. :)
~~Outdoorsy_Girl
thanks girl mwahhhhhhhh!
Keshi.
~~Saby
I agree that not many of us r gonna agree with one another...but that doesnt mean we shouldnt talk abt it...
love one another...it's easy to love another when u dunno his/her background/beliefs etc. The moment one speaks and opinions differ, the love seems to vanish. So, by being able to discuss such controversial issues and yet being able to love one another is the hardest thing to do. And thru my blog u wud have seen that alot of ppl who claimed to LOVE me just slipped away just cos I didnt agree with them :) And if we can talk abt something and still be friends and honestly love one another, thats the true test of LOVE.
**an exercise in futility
so this is not futile at all :)
Keshi.
That's a beautiful post...Intelligent Design? Hmm, I thought of something along the way of computerized art formations..Wrong..I like your explanation. I believe in God and that truly makes sense.
Now about yourself, you truly are a wonderful person even though you stated the things you did and I'm glad to be able to comment back and forth with you. You got a friend here!
That peacock feather pic is simply tooo beautiful(some credit has to go to the photographer too:) )
both of u r way too kind...:)
** and u say nature & evolution created us this way..then who created nature and evolution?
well who created god? if u can accept god as someone who just exists and wasn'd created then why not the same with what we call 'nature'?
u choose to believe in something beyond perception as the supreme ... I choose to believe in the incomprehensible aspect of that which encompasses us as the supreme :) ... we dun disagree ... just that we see things differently ... vagaries of perception (as Agent Smith wud say :p)
** Anyways lets just agree to disagree Samy...better that way that argue endlessely :)
:)) too tired?
south .. its the way u perceive!!!
am not kind wind :d
loll
bus yuhii kabhi kabhi achi ban jati hu
keshi
nanananana???/
y???
loll
~~Purplecupcake
hey thanks and u've got a friend too HUGGGGGGGGGGGGGZ Cupcake!
~~Shikha
yes it's a beautiful feather ha...and yeah credit should be given to the clicker too :)
~~DanB
hey WC Dan and I did check ur blogs out...thanks a ton! :)
~~Samy
ello ello :)
**well who created god?
Only God wouldnt have a Creator...cos He's the highest above all...that's my belief.
**we dun disagree ... just that we see things differently
thats disagreeing on each other's views isnt it :):)
**too tired?
hell na..not tired at all...just that i dun want or backNforth arguments to end up in a misunderstanding that might wreck our friendship...cos u know it happened to me many times b4 even tho those who dumped me for their belief were not worth it anyways :):)
Keshi.
~~Uttsy
**nanananana???/
lol that was to say NO NO NO :):)
Keshi.
my woof woof puppy hope u doing gr88 2de :p
woof woof Im ok..woof woof...how abt ya woof woof?
:):)
Keshi.
seem to be in a spiritual mood....
Its an interesting topic that fascinates me all the time.
Saby wishes me to involve into a sexy man like him? Hahahahahhahahah why on earth you think youre sexy? Just because of your hairy ape chest?
Well, hairy or hairless doesn’t change the fact that I AM THE MASTER IN BED!!!! I know how to push women’s buttons.. that is all what matter!
...hey sweetie, glad to hear ur ok na but u know what? im havin' fever right now sobbssss ;( ;( ! yeah, got cold from rina so like you im back to bed ;( i read ur comment just now on my post and lolssss!! to slowing drug hahaha ^_^ ur hyper na that's why :P ROFL....
...let's take a good rest both!
..hugss u kesh muahh!
...back to bed noww>>>>>
kathy fades........................!
keshi dumbass !
u r a nut case
lotta guys want to be on yr good side and will agrre wid u to the death
but a guy like STUD
he gott spunk
like Jay
and then ego clashes happen
like it happened with me a couple of times
and then there is the Keshi clone to fan the fires
its not so easy to detect the big bad wolf in sheep's clothing
i learned a lott about these guys when i was Julia for a year
CYNO was an out and out bad guy
but he is VIKAS KAUL in real
see his comments in De Vile
~~TLW
thanks :)
~~Jay
Jay what matters to u may not matter to someone else...this is not abt who's good in bed or who's got bigger assets :)
** why on earth you think youre sexy? Just because of your hairy ape chest?
I think ur obsessed abt hair on chest..give it a break and u shall be ok.
~~Lil_Kath
omg ur sick now? Goshhhhhhhh I'll be there soon..huggggggggggggz!
~~Saby
**but a guy like STUD
he gott spunk
they may sound 'SPUNK' or what-not to u...but perhaps I dun feel the same way abt them...ok??? So if u agree with them u can go hang ard with them..I have no probs. And u should have told me b4 that u agree with what Stud had to say abt me!
I dun need u to tell me who's a wolf, rat or elephant for that matter...I have a brain and I can figure that out Saby. thanks anyways!
btw I knew abt Cyno long time ago...u only knew now? lol!
Keshi.
Darwin's theory is long back proved wrong and the evolution of the universe...the big bang or wat ever all just hypothesis...no evidence
i beleive in God the Ultimate who created us...There is somethin beyond our human brains....
He the worlds best architect....the master mind...the master planner..
@saby
we are just empty vessels that make noise...i include myself in the group...we would not breath today if He thinks we should not....
~~Sophie
ur spot on! I like the way u think..
**we are just empty vessels that make noise...i include myself in the group...we would not breath today if He thinks we should not....
I agree and I'm an empty vessel too who thinks I know wut Im doing hehehe...but yeah, my breath is His wish...
Keshi.
Keshi,
Intelligent Design or Design of a natural Intelligence
:)
Keshi dear...I cant believe that we both were thinking the same...as I speak about the nature during my weekend break and so you here :)
I guess it speaks all about what we think and what nature is all about :)
I like the way of your presentation...keep going gal
hugggz
Cheers
gases made earth
Earth made nature
Nature made man
Man made WHATNOT!
lol nywyz the point is Artificial intelligence and things like these are juz being created for man's ease!
They juz want to rest back and want everything to be done by robots and Machines juz not by them
Though if there is god and he created Humans!
Why is there a diversity btw good and evil
Working and non working
Rich and poor
And Healthy and Malfunctionin
~~Marthyan
hey mate :)
**Intelligent Design or Design of a natural Intelligence
works both ways I think..good one!
~~Dawn
hey Dawny...awwww yeah...u r the nature babes na...God's own beautiful creation...
God prolly spent a lot more time on ya...
Huggggggggz!
~~Wanderer
hey Wandy!
**gases made earth
Earth made nature
Nature made man
Man made WHATNOT
Who made the gases then? :)
**Why is there a diversity btw good and evil
Working and non working
Rich and poor
And Healthy and Malfunctionin
Imagine if we all were good, beautiful, working, rich, healthy and happy? Wud we need a world at all?
Keshi.
Actually, man created god in his own image to explain the wonders of nature all around him, because his primitive brain couldn't understand anything beyond the world being flat and the sun revolving around the earth.
You know, man understands the concept of someone being in charge better than any other concept, so he created god in the image of his wise old grandfather, complete with beard.
Study the Queensland lung fish to see how we all stepped out of the primeval swamp and breathed.
Considering that the world has been around for hundreds and hundreds of millions of years and God for two thousand, did the old boy miss the evolution bus and have to wait until donkeys evolved to hitch his wagon to to catch up?
do u enjoy other things too like loving, caressing, kissing, fondling other than being saracastic? :D
;)
WC Fletcher :)
**Study the Queensland lung fish to see how we all stepped out of the primeval swamp and breathed.
Maybe we did...but who created the lung fish? And so on?? :)
**God for two thousand, did the old boy miss the evolution bus and have to wait until donkeys evolved to hitch his wagon to to catch up?
lol funny...however there r myths too and Im not certain abt the dates when God walked the Earth. If u mean Jesus was here 2000yrs ago, well Jesus was a messenger sent by God...so the time is not an error there :)
Keshi.
~~Burf
lol thats a separate post...I thought u read my 'Desert River' post already??
Keshi.
Actually Keshi, I am affording you the freedom to believe in what you want, I never said anything to the contrary. I just don't agree with you.
its not a question of agreeing or not agreeing wrt STUD
its having the guts to speak out your true feelings, ideas and convictions even if u r the only one who feels dat way
Now Sopia will never agree wid my anti-vatican statements
but dat dont mean i dont love Sophia
i do
a lott of guys do
it dont mean i have to love the guys Sophia loves
Sophia
i had a tiff wid known stranger
~~Fletcher
**I am affording you the freedom to believe in what you want, I never said anything to the contrary. I just don't agree with you.
duhh I know that mate :) but that doesnt mean we shouldnt discuss abt it...isnt it?
ok lets just agree to disagree and also agree to end the discussion here :) Thanks!
~~Saby
**its having the guts to speak out your true feelings, ideas and convictions even if u r the only one who feels dat way
so Stud spoke the truth abt me...so u agree? Why dun u speak the truth too then Saby?
Keshi.
Jay dont got beeger assets
he gott beeger ass
and wat buttons he talking about?
i dont see no buttons in the female anatomy
its all about chemistry between u and her
u either have it or u dont
it can be cultivated though
see my SEX COUNSELLOR Blog JAY
the prob wid JAY is he is a computer geek
and he nos all the keyboard shortcuts
there are no shortcuts to developing a relationship
u need time
Christainity dates back about 2000 years ago, you know, first mention of God, Jesus, whatever you want to call him. There is not evidence that god was even thought of beyond 2000 years ago, or thereabouts, passed. Where evolution predates Christianity by about 100 million years, give or take a lazy hundred million years. That was my point. The lung fish evolved over millions of years, probably from a single swimming atom, which were all created by the big bang that created the first sparks of life. No Adam and Eve, no apple, no serpant, they all came along much later, when man started the "who created us" dialogue.
I thought we were discussing it?
But, yes, let's end the discussion here, spoken like a true Christian.
SHIT !
dis Keshi dont hear too well
wat i said was STUD spoke out loud and clear wat he felt
i didnt say i agree with him
i didnt even read all dat he said
but i visited his blog
he seems to be a man of substance
as for TRUTH
Pilate said it best
wat is truth?
Pilate was the governor who allowed the high priests to crucify Jesus even though he believed He was innocent
Helllllo Keshi, how are you dear?
Sorry i didn t write anything lately in your blog,, been very busy yaar... [:(]
Ok, let's jolt back into your issue
well, the pertaining issue lies on the concept on "trust". If you believe that God is the ultimate sheep guide, then it will be. Even wondered why God created men with the ability to think? Well, He needed someone who could guide rest. However, do we see that?
We have placed our needs above the actual chores.Science as you see it-is only a tool creation by weak species called men. Now, science could never replace Godliness no matter what men created.BTW, a research in Imperial college london have came up with an idea to make people look invisible,lol
Cheers KEshi
i hope you no longer in that sombre mood....
Nav
He is the one who designed everything and i agree with sophia's comment that we would not breath if He thinks we should not.
As far as the scientific explaination to that subject is concerned we all have been reading about evolution right from our school days and these days we see a lot of documentaries about it with relevant datas and proves on discovery channel.
Overall a nice topic keshi!
heyyyy
Beaver Fletcher
keshi is Buddhist
though she has some values dat may be considered christian
she loves all *except STUD
and when she gets trapped in a corner
she says lets end the discussion
she just hates to loose
i cant recall a single instance in the 1 and 1/2 year dat i have known her
where she graciously accepted defeat
Okay Saby... inteligent design is to do with cupholders in the dashboards of cars, or two zip pockets on the inside of a handbag.
Keshi, produce one, just one, feeble piece of hard eveidence to back up your ideas on inteligent design? Problem is, I know you can't.
just a few things...
Well evolution is still happening! Remember we are 'made' in millions of years...hundreds of millions of years. We inherited the same systems...ie. digestive, respiration, etc among other mammals...there is no need for systems to develop independantly for each species, its only fine tuned for each species.
I go wrong in search of the truth in the sense that wrong discoveries, not wrong in my principles...
I pray because...Im scared something will happen to my family, friends...
:)
Ok but why wud anyone want to tear down the wall between the Church and the State?
The reason is there are a minority in the US who believe that Christianity is and should be the religion of the US. Tearing down this wall allows them to do that. Direct assaults have been repelled by the courts and so ID is a new way of doing it. No one is stopping yu from believeing in a god, just that ID does not belong in science class.
A lot of religious people agree about ID not being in science class. If one has to teach this it should be in religion class.
But does having no proof always mean there's no truth?
That is correct if you are trying to say I.D. is science then you have to prove that fits basic tenets of science. There has to be an hypothesis that has to be provable. I.D. does not meet those criteria. As someone with training in the sciences for years, I can tell you I.D. fails those criteria, now if you want to say in religion class that there is an intelligent designer behind the universe most people and me have no problem with it.
On the other hand if you try to tell me I.D. is science, sorry it is not.
Before those million years the building blocks of life were present as the planet formed. One of the most primitive forms of life are RNA viruses and prions. They have just the barebones required to function. They have no sensory functions as we know them, just pure biochemistry.
Yes I do believe in evolution and not intelligent desing from a scientific perspective. I.D. is nto science, this is nto about "beleif" it is about provable hypotheses. I.D. faisl that criteria, it meets the criteria about belief, which is what religion is about.
You say science is limited compared to I.D? That is sort of laughable cos all I.D. says is there is a creator behind this universe cos it is so somplex. The burden of proof is then on I.D. proponents to prove it. Since there aren't any criteria that fits scientific principles, we should only consider I.D. a theory or a belief and not science.
I.D. is not science and no one is threatened by it, the biggest objection to is is it's teaching in science curricula. No place there IMHO.
We just agree to disagree, I just wish you lived in the US to truly get a handle on what I.D. is and how the people behind it are theologians who really believe that teaching evolution is undermining people's faith in god.
Religion belongs in religion classes or in the home, not in science class.
@saby
tiff with known stranger?
well, what a great post and what a great God. I'm so thankful that I know him. Keshi, hv u ever wondered how big God is, guess we can never figure it out. I like ur posts.
some emotions can never be artificial !
Human beings die ..machines do not ...
Great post keshi.. quite true how great God is and nature is something i really admire.. there are a number of lessons to be learnt from it..man is now trying to mimic nature(eg. biomimetics) and design various equipments to suit his needs by copying nature's architecture... nature indeed has so much for us to enjoy, relish and seek knowledge...
As Vonegut said if there is Intelligent design what is so intelligent about the clap and giraffes?
The peacock feather is so pretty because over a period of time the peacock with that design got laid a lot more than the others. Nature goes with what works, if it doesn't work it generally gets eaten.
hey kesh:)...sorry i got str8 to commentz...m just rushin rushin rushinnngggg thru blogs:)...wanna wish everyone bye na!...
good to c u back in action...i have to reply to ur mail...i will before i leave...100%!
and it tuk ages for this page to load...*sigh*...i wish there was sum kind of beeper thing that wld alert me on my cell *New Post by Keshi!!* so i cld get in here and post my comment!! :))
the commentz on this one make an interesting read...hmmmm! i'm gonna get back and read everything all over again...and comment! then!
u tk care and keep smilin:)...
keshi my dear CRIKEE you have gone where angels fear to tread. I spend about 80% of my posts on this sort of thing.
Intelligent Design is a sneaky way for the fundaamentalists to wedge religion into the education system.It has NOTHING scientific to offer but it is gaining acceptance in the USofA because 44% of Americans think that Jesus is coming back in their lifetime.
I'm comfortable with real science and it's explanation of everything past the BIG BANG. No problemo.
I lost my Dad when I was still a young man and all of the afterlife and inequality of our existence pose a constant annoying probing from my brain.
I finally realised that we humans cannot answer some questions and that we just have to make the most of our time here.
Life is short and then you die is therefore Life is a garden..dig it!
oh .. you were .. aww noo :D
anyways how are you now??
hey keshi.. howzz u? ya u r rite - man hopefully will not venture into creating things wht God has but he has started modifying it and thts scary..
keshi,
if you ever get this far down the list AREN'T WE MISS POPULAR check out my strine reply on the Bonobos.
Bravo on whacking the hornet's nest of Science & Religion...you've created quite a buzzzzzzzzzzzzzz
Keshi, let me try it again:
The order we find in the universe could have been created by a seperate Entity.
Or a capacity to create order could be an attribute of the universe itself.
One position isn't more or less logical than the other.
We can't get outside the universe to "see." And when we point to analogies using objects within the universe, they're just - analogies. You can say "The universe is like a watch." (Made by a person.) Or, "The universe is like a tomato," or ice crystal, or any natural object, rather than human-made, that displays order without a person there to intelligently design it.
"Intelligent design" is an analogy that says, "The universe is like a man made object" (requiring an outside intelligence to make it).
Analogies aren't logical proofs. A good analogy can help illustrate a truth that's already established to help people follow your point, but you can't analogize anything into existence, including God.
As to why I don't believe in God - well, this particular version of God, which I call "Og" on my own blog - it's because A) it doesn't make sense to me - no evidence for it (Just because a thing's logically conceivable doesn't make you believe it. It's logically possible, for example, that four gods and four goddesses made the universe, but where's the evidence?)
B) I have no motive to believe in such a God.
C) Even if I did, I can't believe something just because I want to.
yeah Sophie
he told me to back off
says he loves u more than i
in his broken english
the guy tinks in tamil
and speaks in english
do u no tamil ?
go go beaver fletcher (*dat sounds cruel) and karnic Jay
where the horny malaysian jay gone?
heyyy Fletcher Beaver and Karmic jay u guys must visit Starbender
an adent supporter of bush and ID
go here
Karmic Jay
Proof is based on logic
but logic has its limitations too
try to logically explain why your girl loves u
u r an asshole
me too
all men are
How come she still loves u and i ?
heyy mate !
great to know you are feeling better :-)
-this going to be lengthy , sorry :-( -
if it cannot be 'disproved' as well, then why is ID considered a problem? Is it just cos we dun u'stand it or just cos it's not a Science we have mastered yet?
it is precisely bc it cannot be proved or disproved that id is a problem when considered as a science subject. it starts with a hypothesis that cannot be proved or disproved.
going by the most comments here some seem to equate science with ultimate truth . it isn't and never pretend to be.
in science theories are advanced, experiments test them, and as long as experiments and observations give the results predicted by that theory it is considered valid. if there is a discrepancy then ppl start searching for a new theory. at the moment for instance experiments show that both the 'general theory of relativity' and 'quantum mechanics' (two main theories in physics and thus all other sciences) cannot both be true at the same time . so ppl are searching for a unified theory.
in other words, in science theories come and go as technology advance and we can test theories with more advanced experiments and observations.
theory of evolution is such a theory. you can disprove it using scientific method, so far nobody has been able to conclusively disprove it, but the possibility is always there. it doesn't pretend to be ultimate truth. it is just a theory that fits with observations. of course some ppl (including some commenters above) believe it to be 'the' truth'. but that is due their mistaken idea about what science is.
on the other hand id by its very hypothesis (which as i said cannot be proved or disproved) is not such a theory. as such it is not science . it may or may not be truth but it cannot be science. it may be theology or philosophy bt not science.
what cannot be understood by the human brain wont always end up being redundant does it?
of course not. but such things do not belong in science but in theology or philosophy, and they are already there long before id as such id is sort of redundant there too.
so r u saying there may have been a God that may have designed evolution?
my point i that one could argue that, if one believe in god. it does not necessarily mean one has to reject evolution wholesale bc there is no incompatibility.
may seem meaningless only cos we cant understand certain things :)
yes you are right. what one does not understand is by definition meaningless. :-)
that's what Science is - we need everything in set results or else we think it's meaningless
not exactly. what is not amenable to scientific method is not science, that is all. as i said ppl should not 'belive' in science as if it is a religion. it merely explains things according to the set methods. it has credibility bc of those methods, but somethings are not amenable to its methods. ppl should not confuse them .
how do we know that there's nothign after death? No dead man lived to tell that isnt it :)
you are right. nobody can prove it. one can say there is nothing or one can create a belief in after life, reincarnation etc. it is as one wish.
And how do we know that this peacock feather is a result of evolution? Even if it was, then who designed evolution?
peacock feather can be explained by theory of evolution bt as for the second question and for all the theories of observable universe(not just evolution which is merely a derivative theory from more fundamental theories), it as before, one can say it is completely random chance that one is in an universe that obey certain theories (if one was in another universe with different physical laws one would not be there to observe the universe ), or say there was designer. as one wish.
So who designed Man then?
imo nobody ! imo operation of physical processes as explained by various scientific theories designed the man. in other words it was quite random . when one throw dice one will get one of six numbers but if huge numbers of dice are being thrown some may get six. given the size of the universe all things are possible.
of course you are not required to 'belive' that. you can believe there was a designer .
just cos it cannot be proved, does it make it untrue?
so anything that's not within Science's limits get disregarded as somethign non-existent?
no. as i said it is just not science that is all.
but we dun have to fight lol! :) We can just duscuss like we r doing here na. p
you are right . :-) i would rather forgo every thing i said if i thought we are fighting . we are not doing so, that is why i say what i say..
ppl who dun tolerate others' harmless beliefs r pathetic.
right you are. :-)
so u think this world is meaningless chaos? why?
well i cannot quite get myself to believe in god etc. so meaningless chaos it is. lol.
sorry for the length. quite inexcusable that. anyway i said what i think of the whole thing. thanks.
have great day !
men are creeps (unlovable)
woman loves man
God loves man
hence God is a woman Q.E.D
~~Saby
**and he nos all the keyboard shortcuts
lol haha so funny!
**i cant recall a single instance in the 1 and 1/2 year dat i have known her where she graciously accepted defeat
very funny Saby. Since when did u start thinking that my blog posts r a competition where there is victory and defeat at the end of the day? These r my deepest thoughts and beliefs...and just cos someone doesnt agree with me, that doesnt mean that I/him/her is a winner/loser. So I guess I dun have to 'graciously accept defeat' (as u put it in ur own words) in any of my posts. I may be wrong/right but that's not a 'defeat' to me...it's just a difference of opinion...what's right to me may be wrong to u and vice versa. I never think of my thoughts here as self-righteous and greedy posts forced upon ppl. If u feel I'm that way (which Im quite surprised to hear from u) ur most WC NOT to visit my blog. I think I have told that to everyone b4.
Keshi.
~~Fletcher_Beaver
hi Fletcher!
**Christainity dates back about 2000 years ago, you know, first mention of God, Jesus, whatever you want to call him.
that's the only FIRST mention of God that u have heard of :)
**There is not evidence that god was even thought of beyond 2000 years ago, or thereabouts, passed.
Really? :):) but did u know that Hinduism is the oldest religion in the world, dating back to millions of years?? If u didnt know abt that well thats ok.
**I thought we were discussing it?
But, yes, let's end the discussion here, spoken like a true Christian.
Im not a 'Christian'...I respect all religions though I have a Hindu/Buddhist background. Basically I believe in one God.
**Okay Saby... inteligent design is to do with cupholders in the dashboards of cars, or two zip pockets on the inside of a handbag.
ahemm thats' AI - Artificial Intelligence. There's a difference.
**Keshi, produce one, just one, feeble piece of hard eveidence to back up your ideas on inteligent design? Problem is, I know you can't.
Nope..the problem is not that I cant...the problem is ur not ready to accept anything beyond what u know :) Proof is in u urself...
Thanks anyways!
Keshi.
~~NavFalco
hey Nav good to see ya bakk :)
**Science as you see it-is only a tool creation by weak species called men. Now, science could never replace Godliness no matter what men created
Spot on!
lol @invisible...I desperately need to buy that mechanism cos I wanna make some ppl invisible..hahahaha!
Have a good day Nav!
Keshi.
~~Sunita
aha it's all in the school books na :):)
How u been sweety?
Keshi.
~~Ghost_Particle
hey Ghostyyyy!
**I go wrong in search of the truth in the sense that wrong discoveries, not wrong in my principles...
aha gotcha this time :)
hey dun worry...nuttin will happen to ur family...tc n have a good day!
Keshi.
~~Karmic_Jay
hey Jay :)
I agree that ID may not be a Science...as it's not 100% provable in scientific terms...but Science is provable only cos we understand what falls under Science right now...and ID is not understood yet cos it's too complex for man to understand it...co if it was any easier we wud have conquered that too by now - but no one really knows about it yet. thats my point.
**what I.D. is and how the people behind it are theologians who really believe that teaching evolution is undermining people's faith in god.
Just like that, the ppl behind Scienec r scientists who really believe that teachinh ID is undermining Science :)
Anyways I guess ID is more exposed in the US than in Aus...in Aus they just proposed that course in UNSW and there's alot of debate that's going on...lets see what happens :)
Thanks so much for ur enlightening comments Jay...
Keshi.
~~Christabelle
hey WC Christabelle and thanks :)
**Keshi, hv u ever wondered how big God is, guess we can never figure it out
yeah..the bigger and the more complex anything/anyone is, the harder for us to figure it out...so we somehow diregard it...hehehe...
Thanks dear!
Keshi.
~~Euphoric_Dreamer
hey hows u?
**some emotions can never be artificial !
Spot on!
**Human beings die ..machines do not ...
machines die too but they dun have emotions...:)
Keshi.
~~Prithz
hey Prithz howd?
**man is now trying to mimic nature(eg. biomimetics) and design various equipments to suit his needs by copying nature's architecture.
hehe yes...man can only imitate :)
Keshi.
~~The_Phosgene_Kid
hey Kid how's it going?
**what is so intelligent about the clap and giraffes?
hehehe...can u make a giraffe?
Keshi.
~~Ishita
omg ur abt to leave na? awwwwwwwwwwwwwwwwwwwwww :*(
SOBBBBBBBBBBBBBBBBBBBBBBBBBBBBBBBBBBBBBBBBBBBBBBBBBBBBBBBBBBZ!
I'll be there soon...in ut blog...hugggggggggz!
Keshi.
~~Homo_Escapeons
hey dude hows ya? ;-)
**Intelligent Design is a sneaky way for the fundaamentalists to wedge religion into the education system.
what I dun u'stand is why anything related to faith is considered something sneaky??
yes we humans r so limited in understanding many things including our ownselves...but we still think we know it all :)
Keshi.
~~Archana
hey girl Im well now thanks n hugggggz!
Keshi.
~~Vivhyd
hey Viv Im good n u?
**man hopefully will not venture into creating things wht God has but he has started modifying it and thts scary..
yes I know...cloning and all that garbage..hehe..
Keshi.
~~Darius
hey Mate I see wut u mean...u r saying that there's no need to always have a creator for a creation...I somehow cant believe in that cos any creation has got to be created by a creator :)
**B) I have no motive to believe in such a God.
no probs mate....ur entitled to believe what u wanna believe...
**C) Even if I did, I can't believe something just because I want to.
ur right...it's meaningless to believe in something just cos u want to believe in it.
tc and thanks!
Keshi.
but u gotta give it to Oprah
she has answers to all the questions in the world
even solomon in all his wisdom
had not dis
he only had more questions sometimes
~~Sittingnut
hey matey hows ya? now dun be sorry for lengthy replies..ur most WC to say wuteva u wanna say here, u know that na :)
**it is precisely bc it cannot be proved or disproved that id is a problem when considered as a science subject. it starts with a hypothesis that cannot be proved or disproved.
ok maybe it's not a science..yet. but we humans have limited brain capacity to understand everything too..isnt it.
**theory of evolution is such a theory. you can disprove it using scientific method, so far nobody has been able to conclusively disprove it, but the possibility is always there.
aha...possibilities that we havent met yet...
**it may or may not be truth but it cannot be science. it may be theology or philosophy bt not science.
it cannot be Science cos we havent understood it yet...thats what I believe. But ofcourse ur entitled to believe what u believe :)
**yes you are right. what one does not understand is by definition meaningless. :-)
hehehe true :)
but when u see an aeroplane up in the sky, u admire it and consider it to be a superb product of complex and great design...and u wont understand all the mechanisms inside of it but it's stil not 'meaningless', is it? And if u take the time and patience to study aerospace engineering, perhaps u will understand it :)
**nobody can prove it. one can say there is nothing or one can create a belief in after life, reincarnation etc. it is as one wish.
its just 'unknown' to us so far...
**given the size of the universe all things are possible.
Again thats only a possibility :)
**well i cannot quite get myself to believe in god etc. so meaningless chaos it is. lol.
u dun have to believe in a God to make the world meaningful Sittingnut :)
I'm glad u said ur honest opinion on this...it's very interesting to know how u think abt this...I'm learning alot and I have grown so much just by reading all ur comments...thank u so much!
Keshi.
~~Niki
hey Bakshi babez thanks :)
huggggggz!
Keshi.
SABY wrote:
sittingnut
i am saying that GOD exists
God designed evolution
i say dis bcoz i trust science too
but tomorrow another theory will crop up from new found evidence
i will believe dat too for the moment
wat makes me say God exists?
God speaks to me
and He is a Joker, (He is laffing up there now)
i seen bad days, real bad
went into acute clinical depression
my shrink gave me shock theraphy followed by medication
i turned bi-polar. oscillating btw highs and lows
i was like a puppet in the hands of my wife
when i got high and my wife didnt like it
she gave ne a pill widout my noledge (in my tea)
THUD! i fell down
dis went on till i cud take it no longer
i began going to church everyday in the morning and prayed like crazy
today i dont need medication
today i dont worry
right now i have only 1,800 rs in the bank
but i no the money will come
when i need it
the last time i gott an income tax refund, when i was broke
my wife worries
she is a sceptic
she explained it as coincidence
Saby.
I can't even begin 2 tell U how much I luv this post. This is and has been 4 a bit-my favorite subject. It IS totally amazing-- why I have the upmost respect 4 this area is--Man has only recently been able to decode our DNA, it is soooo complex and massive, that we couldn't even begin 2 try---UNTIL WE CREATED
THE S U P E R - C O M P U T E R.
That right there is ONE small example of why there
IS A GOD!!!
:)
First, lemme comment seriously:
Man (and woman too :P ) created God
Second, let me comment not so seriously :
if at all God exists, He showed intelligence in creating you, but then again He created me, and put a question mark on His intelligence :(
talldarkman
PS : Is God masculine or feminine?
i hate keshi and the guys wid scissors, the censors
didnt expect starbender to show up here
so close on my heels
GOD help me now
~~Starbender
hey Star I'm glad u agree with me on this...
**an has only recently been able to decode our DNA, it is soooo complex and massive,
yes...genetics is one area that man hasn't conquered yet...doctors still go ard saying they dun u'stand genes all that much and just assign some diseases to be 'genetic' and thats abt it...easier that way :)
Keshi.
~~TallDarkMan
het TDM :):)
**if at all God exists, He showed intelligence in creating you, but then again He created me, and put a question mark on His intelligence
lol na..He created TDM and and showed that Flirting can be an occupation :):)
Is God a man or a Woman? mmmm guess God is both in many different ways...go figure!
Keshi.
There is a fabulous ultimate positive force that created all souls and even created the various gods and goddessess that people revere. However I wonder: does it abandon us once it has created us leaving us to fuck things up as we have, or does it care and feel our sorrows? I don't think it directly intervenes for it isn't like us at all. That is why it gave us the Gods and Goddesses. But sometimes they don't intervene either. It's all a big mystery that I don't claim to understand but will study for all my life because I really do want to know!
Peace.
well narrated post
Where was the creator when he was creating the Universe is a question i always wonder- assuming that creator do existed to creator.
Like the way we do theorms in Mathematics and physics.
first postulate he existed then i wonder where was he when the universe was of created by him.
Starbender.. Next time you fall sick, just try faith based healing. Try not to go to a doc mmkay? :)
Just like that, the ppl behind Scienec r scientists who really believe that teachinh ID is undermining Science :)
It is true that it is undermining science. You are trying to introduce something that fits no scientific criteria and expecting people to just accept it?
Thats not how science works. That's faith and that's why I.D rightly belongs in religion classes.
Hi, Keshi - This is interesting, because you write, "hey Mate I see wut u mean...u r saying that there's no need to always have a creator for a creation...I somehow cant believe in that cos any creation has got to be created by a creator :)
Sounds like you're reacting the same way I did when I first read the disproof to the teleological argument - also a few of the other arguments for God's existence just sounded so compelling when you first read them.
I wanted to believe them, and like you, recognized that like everyone, I was entitled to my opinion. The thing is, (of course I was also taking a class and not just communicating with somebody out there in cyberspace) it was very clear that these arguments just plain don't work. It's like saying you can see how 2 + 2 = 5.
In other words, logic is more like math than like an opinion. There's sound logic and there's flawed logic. There's also a history behind the attempted proofs. It's the route to belief in God that the Scholatics hoped would work in the Middle Ages - they really really wanted to convince everybody to believe in God.
So if you attend divinity school today, you find people who believe in God all over the place. But they don't believe based on logic. Could be that if you looked at it long and hard enough, you'd find a different basis for the same belief you now have - although you probably have no immediate plans for divinity school!
There has to be a God who holds the copy-rights for the splendid and priceless design
I like this line, because it gives me hope. I do believe in God, but I don't understand His plan about death. I do however have hope that all will be okay in the end.
saby :
lol.
keshi :
it is i who learn from you
from the first time i read this blog :-)
if u take the time and patience to study aerospace engineering, perhaps u will understand it
yes but somethings in this world will never be understood in the same way a scientific theory explain things. one can study all life or in some cases ppl have been studying them from beginning of human history with no result. (difference between good and bad for instance)
one just have to believe or not. if one cannot believe world becomes chaotic.
but as long as there are angels in it one can bear it :-)
~~Cheesemeister
hey Meister hows u today?
**does it abandon us once it has created us leaving us to fuck things up as we have, or does it care and feel our sorrows?
I often wonder abt that too...why 'we' r so screwed up. But there's the 'we' in it...we weer given the choices therefore we r responsible for wherever/whatever we r..dun u think so?
~~Knonw_Stranger
yes even in Science there r alot of 'assumptions' :)
~~Karmic_Jay
G'day Jay :)
** Next time you fall sick, just try faith based healing. Try not to go to a doc mmkay
hehehe...well to be honest I hardly go to the doc for anything...not that I leave it all to 'faith' :) but I dun have much 'faith' in docs either hahahaha!
**That's faith and that's why I.D rightly belongs in religion classes.
mmmm ok :)
Thanks Jay!
~~Darius
hi mate!
Logic is what we created too :)
~~Terry
yeah girl..I know...Death is so punishing and I often wondered why a God would create something like death...but I may know the reason for that too...but that's altogether a different post ok? :) Thanks sweety!
~~Sittingut
heyyyy hows u? :)
aww Im learning from u too...we all r learning alot from each other...I really admire the intelligence in all of us here...it really makes us all grow..thats the best part of blogging!
Thanks and lets just say u believe in Evolution and I believe in Evolution and a Creator :)
Have a good day mate!
Keshi.
A divine message:
I know your name, your degrees, your profession, your status and your history. I know your past, present and future. But you do not know me. That is why sometimes in order to reveal who I am, I myself show my visiting card, something which you call a 'miracle'.
Peace cannot be found in the external world but within oneself. One should realize that the whole universe is pervaded by the Divine. Today the world is filled with strife. It is not possible to make a distinction between a human being and a demon. Man, who evolved from the animal, instead of proceeding towards Divinity, is regressing to animality. Man's primary duty is to uphold the human values of Truth, Righteousness, Peace and Love. However, man today is enveloped in attachment and hatred. The moment he casts them off, he will realize his divinity.
I read the above somewhere...
Thanks all for ur very interesting and intelligent contribution to this topic.
Keshi.
SHIT!
i will not let her have the last word
i say
AMEN
ok then Saby!
:)
Keshi.
it is beautiful girl....love it..love it...love it :)
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